CCUK: CarCrime.UK
NVCRP: National Vehicle Crime Reduction Programme
08/2024 from CCUK:
I have made a request about ‘weeding’ – WhatDoTheyKnow.
I am concerned this process is causing unnecessary problems; that it is archaic, serves
no good purpose and if abolished, could reduce police admin’. It appears to assist none,
other than those who steal vehicles.
I have several suggestions about vehicle theft being concerned at the marked increase. I
would welcome the opportunity to develop ideas to assist the police, victims, and their
insurers.
01/09/2025 @ 13:45 From: REDACTED. To: NVCRP
Sent: 01 September 2025 1:45 PM
To:
Cc: NVCRP
Subject: FW: ‘Weeding’
Good afternoon Sir,
Merseyside Police have received the below Subject Access Request from [CCUK], whom I understand you are likely familiar with. As the correspondence sought is in respect of ACC NPCC role as Vehicle Crime Lead, it is for the NPCC to progress the request (rather than the Force). I am advised that you would be best placed to do so, in the capacity of NPCC Staff Officer to ACC however if this is incorrect then I would ask that you forward this on to the relevant person/team within the NPCC.
I will reply to [CCUK] advising of the action, however will not provide your details in the event that it is not yourself who will be dealing. I spoke with [CCUK] several months ago in respect of some related issues, the resolution was reached when I explained the distinction between ACC roles within Merseyside Police and the NPCC so I will gently remind him that is the case here.
Kind regards,
01/09/2025 @ 13:53 From: NVCRP. To: REDACTED
Sent: 01 September 2025 13:53
To: REDACTED
Subject: Re: ‘Weeding’
Hi – good to hear from you and thank you for the below. I am in the middle of drafting a response to [CCUK] at the moment regarding the NPCC point of contact for PNC. I am asking him to leave this with me for now and I will explore the options regarding the most appropriate point of contact. I have spoken to him several times on the phone previously as well.
He may actually have a point ref ‘weeding’ and this maybe something that and (NPCC lead for Vehicle Crime) wish to explore moving forward – but I can discuss this with both Oli and Sarah.
I am copying you into my email just so that everyone is sighted on the responses.
Alex – as a starting point for me – can you remind me who has the PNC portfolio in Merseyside please. It doesn’t need to be ACC rank but some reasonably senior that I could speak to regarding processes / weed dates etc – just for my own understanding
Many thanks
NVCRP Project Lead
Safer Business Network CIC
01/09/2025 @ 14:12 From: REDACTED. To: NVCRP
Sent: 01 September 2025 2:12 PM
To: NVCRP
Subject: RE: ‘Weeding’
Afternoon Sir,
Thanks for the below, I hope you’re keeping well and it certainly sounds like you’re keeping busy. You will have seen that I replied to [CCUK] prior to your email, but will hang fire on anything further.Having worked on the PNC Bureau and the control room prior to that, when we spoke on the phone a few months back I found the points he raised to be quite interesting and we had a pleasant conversation as a result.
Within Merseyside, PNC sits in Criminal Justice – the PNC & Data Access Manager is ) and he has suggested it may be beneficial to link in with , the Chair of the National PNC Vehicles & Property
group ( ) at a national level. (DVLA Liaison & Release & Retention Manager) is also very knowledgeable regarding the ELVIS/PNC aspectIf there’s anything further I can assist with please let me know.
Kind regards,
Data Access Supervisor
Merseyside Police
01/09/2025 @ 16:23 From: NVCRP. To: redacted
Sent: 01 September 2025 16:23
To [REDACTED]
Subject: Re: ‘Weeding’
Thats great – many thanks for the contact details. I hope you’re keeping well, and thanks for the response to PS too. – are you happy to contact pick this up with her, but just noting that that the issue at hand is –
seeing as she is a Sussex officer? I am happy to is Sussex too. On a basic level, I believeThe potential delay from a vehicle being initially reported as LoS before being confirmed as stolen on the PNC – The issue being if that vehicle were to be stopped in the interim period prior to being confirmed as stolen. I would hope that the LoS marker would generate sufficient suspicion of the officers to investigate this further – but of course this may not be available if it were an ANPR hit for example. I think the issue that PS raises, and circulated as NPCC lead, is that stolen vehicles can be missed or take too long to be recorded as confirmed stolen on the PNC, or never confirmed due to admin error?
The second point, again as I understand it, is the fact that stolen vehicles that aren’t recovered are subject to a 6 year ‘weeding’ process which would mean they potentially drop off the PNC. There may be good reason for this from an administrative point of view, or the numbers that are O/S after 6 years may be incredibly small. Nonetheless it would be good to get some clarity on these points and to see if there are any ‘quick wins’ to feed back to partners
Happy to discuss as always
NVCRP Project Lead
02/09/2025 @ 10:10 From: REDACTED. To: NVCRP & one unidentified recipient
From: (likely an identifiable person @ Merseyside police)
Sent: 02 September 2025 10:10 AM
Subject: RE: ‘Weeding’
Morning both,
I’ve just checked with REDACTED our ELVIS/PNC font of knowledge and he’s confirmed:
- Following the NPCC circulation from REDACTED, Merseyside will confirm LoS within 24 hours – this is largely an automated process using Elvis and once the OIC has the crime reference number. I believe we are the only Force to use this system (maybe one more, but in the minority)
- An unconfirmed LoS will register on ANPR the same as a confirmed report will
From [CCTK] previous FOI requests, he has originally raised concerns over the 6-week weeding period – if a Force did not confirmed the LoS within 6 weeks (42 days) of it being added to the PNC, then the report drops off completely.
This used to be done by way of a Form 150 in Merseyside but since we used ELVIS it’s a box ticked to confirm.
When I spoke with the PNC Manager here, REDACTED, he advised that this was originally implemented due the possibility of false stolen reports being made by malicious parties.
The issue that [CCUK] highlighted when I spoke with him, and in those previous requests, is such that any stolen vehicles not confirmed within the 6 weeks would not appear stolen on PNC,not activate ANPR* etc, and so continue to be driven undetected and unrecovered.
Many years ago, I worked in the control room and dealt with a call in which exactly this had happened – a report of an abandoned vehicle which had been parked up for months, PNC was clear but when I checked local ELVIS it was outstanding stolen, having been taken during a burglary some six months prior and hadn’t been confirmed.
He further explained that part of the service he offers his customers** is essentially an update check for their stolen vehicles, and he became aware that this issue was occurring across a number of Forces through his role.
I hope this assist, if there’s anything further I can help with please let me, know, otherwise I’ll let you know if PS gets back in touch.
Kind regards,
Data Access Supervisor
* in addition, the DVLA would never be made aware of the LoS status
** we provide a unique ‘safety net’ for the police and insurers – monitoring the LoS status of a VRM to promptly alert to any removal. We are therefore notified of a PNC removal that results from ‘weeding’ and can react to it promptly.
2026 03/2026 approx. – date unspecified. NVCRP comment
‘[this] … relates to me discussing changes to the PNC recording system around how stolen vehicles are recorded on the Police National Computer and also when they are ‘weeded’ from it.
[CCUK] has a long-standing issue over this process as he see’s there being vulnerabilities to it and inefficiencies too. This topic forms the vast majority of all email trails.
My relationship with [CCUK] is almost exclusively regarding this matter and my attempts to raise his concerns with NPCC and provide responses to his queries / concerns.